Author Topic: The Chart of Meghan Markle, Prince Harry's Girlfriend, with AA birth time  (Read 386 times)

Offline Pamela Young

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I've just found Meghan Markle's birth time on Astrodatabank, and it's rated AA, from the birth certificate:  4 August, 1981, 4:46 a.m., Canoga Park, California.

I can't post charts myself, but here's the link to her Astrodatabank profile, where you can see her chart:

www.astro.com/astro-databank/Markle,_Meghan

I'll be back to this thread after studying her chart.

Offline Dean Bensics

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Hello Forum.

1) Both Sun (in Leo) and Uranus are peregrine by aspect…a unique out-of-the-box individual; definite star quality. Notice how Sun tightly trines the MC.

2) MC=Moon-Jupiter-Saturn…Moon and Saturn rule the ASC-DSC; Jupiter rules the 6th of service. Jupiter and Saturn are Royal archetypes in that they involve responsibility and duty to the Church and State.

3) The stellium is in Libra (relationships) and makes a sextile to Mercury-Nodes which are across the relationship axis and in Leo-Aquarius…a fated relationship into Royalty.

4) Mars rules the MC and is in the 12th squaring the stellium…a career subsumed into a large institution (The Monarchy aka “The Firm”).

I think she has a very Royal chart and would fit into the role nicely. She was born for it.

Regards,
Dean Bensics
« Last Edit: March 16, 2017, 06:26:59 PM by Dean Bensics »

Offline Pamela Young

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Thank you so much for your comments, Dean.  I got busy earlier today with some non-astrological stuff and wasn't able to work on the chart as I'd planned. I hope to be able to come back tomorrow and check it out further. Thanks again.

Regards,
Pam

Offline Pamela Young

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I've been reading up on Meghan Markle; she's a really fascinating individual, not your average Hollywood actress at all.  I can see why Prince Harry is interested in her; it's definitely not just because of her looks.  I'll come to her chart in a bit, but first some background.

She was the child of a Caucasian father (Dutch and Irish parentage), Thomas Markle Sr., and an African-American mother, Doria Ragland.  They met on the set of the TV soap opera, 'General Hospital', where he was the lighting director and she was a temp at the studio; she eventually got a master's degree in social work, and became a yoga instructor.  He went on to be in charge of the lighting for the TV show 'Married with Children', and Meghan used to go there after school and hang out on the set.

Meghan's parents divorced when she was six, and I wasn't able to find out for sure what the custody arrangements were.  Her father had two other, older children from his first marriage, a son, Thomas Markle Jr., and a daughter Samantha, now Samantha Grant, aged 51.  Samantha says that she raised Meghan for twelve years, which you would take to mean that Meghan lived primarily with her father after the divorce.  Samantha hates Meghan, according to her own mother, Roslyn, who says Samantha has been down on Meghan since the latter was about fifteen.  Samantha is now in a wheelchair and has been since 2008, because of multiple sclerosis.  She says that Meghan has cut her out of her life since she went into the wheelchair, not wanting to be 'embarrassed' by her, and that she has not helped her family out financially even though she can more than afford to (her father went bankrupt recently).  Samantha says Meghan is "narcissistic and selfish," "a hypocrite," and now calls her "Princess Pushy."  Others, including Samantha's own mother, say she's just jealous of Meghan, and that everything negative she's said about her is totally untrue.

I think it would be fair to say that Meghan's biracial heritage has been extremely important in forming the person she has become.  She says she gets asked every day, "What are you?" meaning, what is her ethnic background.  She says she always replies, "I'm an actress, a writer, the Editor-in-Chief of my lifestyle brand The Tig, a pretty good cook and a firm believer in handwritten notes."  Then she says she gives them the answer they want: she's half black and half white.  She remembers her mother crying in the car, her hands shaking as she drove, because someone yelled "Nigger!" at her.  And she remembers that, back in Grade 7, she had to fill out a mandatory census with the rest of her English class, which requested info on, among other things, their racial identity.  You had to select a box: white, black, Hispanic or Asian; but there was no box for her: half-white and half-black.  Her teacher told her to check 'Caucasian,' "... because that's how you look, Meghan."  Meghan was mortified; she kept thinking how hurt her mother would be if she found out, so she didn't check any of the boxes, just left that question blank.  Later she told her father what had happened, and he, visibly angry, said, "If that ever happens again, you make your own box."  She says she remembers that now when she thinks of her great-great-great-grandfather back in 1865, when slavery was abolished; the ex-slaves had to pick surnames for themselves, and he picked as his surname, 'Wisdom.'  As she says, he made his own box.  (I like this woman; someone like this should be Queen).

In 2003 she graduated from Northwestern University with a double degree in theatre and international relations.  She had turned into a beautiful girl and went on to become an actress, which involved her fair share of going to auditions and being rejected; as she says, she was too black for some roles and not black enough for others.  She supported herself during this time, in lieu of waitressing, by working as a calligrapher; she did handwritten wedding invitations and such, which apparently was quite a  lucrative job and she was very in demand, because so few people can do it any more.  (She says she learned how at her all-girls' Catholic school, where they still had handwriting class).  She gradually got some small parts in a number of TV shows and movies, but it was only when the role of Rachel Zane came along, in the TV show 'Suits,' that the perfect role for her came her way.  (Though when they had a black man play her father, some people wrote in along the lines of, 'Ew, she's black?  I used to think she was hot.')

Acting, however, is not her only interest, far from it.  It's probably at least partly because of her own family history that she has always been interested in issues of human rights and equality.  Back in 1992, when she was only eleven, she got upset by an ad for dishwashing soap which said, 'Women all over America are fighting greasy pots and pans.'  And some boys said, "Yeah, that's where women belong, in the kitchen."  She embarked on a letter-writing campaign to the manufacturers of the product as well as to a slew of important people including Hillary Clinton, who was the First Lady at the time.  And even though the manufacturers of the soap were the only ones not to reply to her, in the end they changed the wording of the ad from 'women' to 'people.'  Since then she's become the ambassador for World Vision Canada and goes to Rwanda for them on their Clean Water campaign, and she's also a United Nations Women's Advocate, and has been a speaker on International Women's Day.  She believes strongly in giving back, that fame necessitates social responsibility. 

In addition to all this, she partnered with the store Reitmans and started her own line of 'accessible' clothing for young women, the kind of clothes she wears on her TV show, but a lot less expensive (as she says, she can't afford the $5000 skirts she wears on the show either).  She models the clothes in the commercials for this clothing line herself, and it has been hugely successful. 

As if all that weren't enough, she also has her own lifestyle blog, 'The Tig,' in which she writes about clothes, food, wine, yoga, relationships, and her dogs.  She's on Twitter and Instagram and Facebook; you name it, she's on it.  She writes a lot, but she can really write; this is an extremely literate, thoughtful individual.

She was married on September 10, 2011 in Jamaica to Trevor Engelson, a Los Angeles producer; they'd been dating for the six years prior.  Then they split up in May 2013, and divorced in August 2013; Meghan took no spousal support.  She then began living with celebrity chef Cory Vitiello in Toronto but by spring of 2016 things were not going well between them; they were still living under the same roof because, among other things, they had to work out custody of the dogs, but Cory has said that she was full of herself, that she thought she was more famous than she was, and that he was fed up with it.  Be that as it may (it could just be sour grapes on Cory's part after Meghan took up with Harry) it was at this point, late May or early June of 2016, that Meghan met Harry through a mutual friend; Harry was besotted, bombarded her with texts asking her out, and she finally said yes.

So!  Sorry for the long preamble, but I think it will be interesting to use astrology to answer some questions that stem from the above: Is Meghan selfish and a narcissist, as her older sister alleges?  Is she conceited and arrogant, as her ex-partner Cory Vitiello believes?   I think I'm out of room; I'll start a new post about her chart specifically.



« Last Edit: March 17, 2017, 03:51:52 PM by Pamela Young »

Offline Pamela Young

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Well, Dean has already made many salient points about Meghan's chart.  I'll just add a few things I noticed, with regard to some of what I read about and commented on above. 

Meghan has Aries on the MC, and it is very tightly trined by her Sun in Leo, and by Mercury in Leo as well; plus she also has her North Node in Leo, and all this Leo is in her 1st house, which is the natural house of Aries.  So she strikes people as a leader, a trailblazer - a star.

 With Cancer on the Ascendant, her chart is ruled by the Moon, so it is even more important for her than it is for most women.  It is in Libra (the arts; harmony) in the 3rd house (communication, writing); so she has a need to communicate in a harmonious way, which will probably be expressed through some form of art.  And the Moon is conjunct both Jupiter (enthusiasm; philosophy) and Saturn (responsibility; authority), also in Libra in the 3rd house.  This stellium is sextiled by the 1st house Mercury in Leo; it sextiles Saturn exactly.  So writing, and indeed communication in all forms, is likely to be a very important part of her life; writing comes easily to her, and she is likely to spend a great deal of her time and energy writing and otherwise communicating with others.     

Her Pluto (transformation) is in Libra too, but in the 4th house (family; roots).  This 4th house Pluto is quincunx her Chiron (incurable wound) in Taurus (security; stability) in the 11th house (society; social norms).  So her family background has been a source of emotional pain for her, and this is something that will always be with her.  Many people who have a 4th house Pluto end up moving far away from their birthplace, since they feel they can transform themselves and their lives by making a big change in their home base.  Meghan has moved from Los Angeles to Toronto, which is certainly far from where she grew up.  But a bigger move could conceivably be in the offing.

To return to the 3rd house Libra stellium, this includes her chart ruler, the Moon, and it is very closely conjunct Jupiter and Saturn, so it is going to be very important.  This stellium is in opposition to the 9th house, of course, which is empty but has Pisces (glamour; fantasy; sacrifice; deceit) on the cusp.  Jupiter is the traditional ruler of Pisces, so the combined energy of this Libra stellium is likely to get put into 9th house endeavours, such as travel abroad, higher education, philosophy, religion, and the law.  The modern ruler of Pisces is Neptune (same meanings as Pisces), which is in the 6th house (work; service; health) in Sagittarius; Sagittarius is the sign on the cusp of the natural 9th house, so those themes are repeated again: philosophy, foreign travel, etc.  (Technically Neptune is on the cusp of the 6th house from the 5th, but it's so close that I'm reading it as being a 6th house planet).  Neptune closely sextiles her 4th house Pluto; this is a generational influence, but I suppose you could say that she is using service to others less fortunate in foreign lands to transform herself and give meaning to her life.

Because the Moon rules her chart, I went straight to the Libra stellium, and skipped Venus (values; love) in Virgo (work; service; health), also in the 3rd house.  So clearly she values being of service to others, and is likely to write about it or communicate about it in other ways.  This Venus is quincunx the Aries MC, and sextiles the ruler of the MC, Mars (energy; drive; violence) in Cancer (nurturing) in the 12th house (victims; the wretched of the earth; self-undoing).  So through her writing and other forms of art she can work on helping those in need.

It's interesting, that Mars of hers; being in the 12th house, and in Cancer, it would not normally be considered a good or strong position.  It squares the MC exactly, though, and since it rules the MC, maybe that has made it more powerful than it otherwise would have been.  It's semi-sextile the 1st house Sun in Leo, and it's sesquiquadrate Uranus (upheaval; revolution) in Scorpio (sex; transformation) in the 5th house (romance).  She could possibly get herself into hot water by getting involved in hidden or otherwise risky love affairs; they'll be exciting, quite possibly transforming, but they could also blow up in her face.  But she could also transform herself by putting her energy into the arts as, for example, an actress. 

I think I'm going to have to call it quits for now.  I'll come back tomorrow and see if I should add anything; I've got to take a break.

Offline pdw

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Good points, Dean and Pamela, thanks. I’m adding on a few ideas below…

Quote
1) Both Sun (in Leo) and Uranus are peregrine by aspect

Dean, I agree about her peregrine Uranus but I'm not considering her natal Sun peregrine since it is sextile her natal Jupiter (6 degrees).
   
Both her 1st house starring Leo Sun and acting experience reflect to me a bright, outgoing confidence primed to create value with her resources, work, and self-assurance (Leo 2nd House) - potentially with good results, success, and recognition for her strong, positive individuality (on display, with her natal Sun-Aries MC trine). 

Factoring in her natal Sun-Jupiter sextile, maybe hers is a personality primed to constructively enjoy life, optimism, and making the most of every opportunity… in a way that fulfills her sensitive, caring, protective Cancer Ascendant and considerate Libra Moon. 

A natural poise, sincerity, and serious sense of personal purpose might be reflected by her thoughtful Libra Moon-Saturn-Jupiter, a very socializing influence combined with her aforementioned humanitarian interests, activities, and self-expression (reflecting her standout peregrine 5th House Uranus) - which makes me wonder if she may be especially aware of or drawn to a Royal’s unique power to create and ‘play’ a significant role identified with social goals (referencing her Uranus disposited by influential Pluto; her chart’s current SA Pluto=Uranus potential; and significant transiting Jupiter opportunity, conjunct her natal Pluto and squaring her relationship ASC-DSC axis). 

For solar synastry, her Sun is in Harry’s 7th House, suggesting a strong relationship or marriage tie, I think. However, her Sun also squares Harry’s own peregrine natal Saturn at MC which looks like a difficult, stifling connection or challenging circumstances for her Sun to work with, at best. Maybe this one reflects the regimentation and wealthy privilege that govern Harry’s life (his Saturn in Scorpio) – with deeply entrenched family ties, expectations, and duty - that might feel personally demanding or oppressive to her (Sun). But, since they are not young and inexperienced 20-somethings, maybe their maturity, now in their 30s, could allow them to consciously face this situation head-on and help each other make it work for them, together…

So, if she’s fallen for the Prince (with T Neptune, in romantic Pisces, opposing her other-oriented Virgo Venus, Libra 4th ruler, with T Neptune conjunct his natal Virgo Mercury and love interests, 5th ruler; while their Virgo friendly, kind and gentle Venus-Mercury synastry is highly sensitized, eclipsed in February) -– or, is already madly in love and considering marriage, children, a major move and lifestyle change (with T Jupiter conjunct her family oriented 4th House natal Pluto, ruling her 5th House loves, children, and creative self-expression) -- and intrigued with this exciting new, attractive, fulfilling life opportunity (with transiting Uranus opposing natal Pluto; intensified with the tight with SA Pluto=Uranus) -- then maybe she'll be ready and willing to redirect her Aquarius 8th House-ruling Uranian independence into a collaborative union on the Royal stage. 

« Last Edit: March 19, 2017, 04:35:39 AM by pdw »

Offline Dean Bensics

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Thanks Pamela and pdw for your analyses.

I wasn't aware of her background other than she is bi-racial and an actress, but, yikes, I think she'd be a major gulp for The Firm to digest.

On the one hand, Camilla, the next Queen, is a divorcee so that hurdle is crossed, but the narcissist label and the family history may be the deal-breaker.

It may not be the Queen who quashes a marriage, but Phillip, who cannot abide any hint of this kind of behavior, whatsoever, even in his own children.

Remember, he was Diana's biggest foe in the Palace; and he remains steadfast in opposing the remarriage of Andrew and Sarah.

Maybe there is a fantastic synastry between Phillip and Meghan that can overcome my concern in this regard.

Waiting him out (at nearly age 96) may be an option. Then again, Harry, with Mercury (r. 5) square Uranus may not be the patient type when it comes to affairs of the heart. And, I come back to the original point I made upthread...Harry's Tr. Saturn quincunx Moon; and approaching Neptune in the 12th.

We shall see.

Regards,
Dean Bensics
« Last Edit: March 19, 2017, 01:36:48 PM by Dean Bensics »

Offline Halina

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Hi Pam, Dean, PDW,  things don't look to rosy for these 2 in the near future.   See biwheel below:  Their composite chart, inner wheel, and transits to this composite, outer wheel.
     Also see Harry's natal chart with transits in the outer wheel, and Secondary Progressed Moon in the 7th House.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2017, 04:48:24 PM by Halina »

Offline Halina

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      Below is Harry's Vedic chart with reasons why this relationship may end with no marriage in sight.   Red dots signify MOST SIGNIFICANT POINTS which are roughly within 5 degrees of the Asc degree.   Jupiter rules 4th House(starting a family) and aspects Mercury in 9th of marriage, religious marriage ceremony.
Mercury rules the 7th, marriage partner and receives no bad aspects.   But we haven't looked at transits to his natal Vedic chart yet.   See next chart....
it is his natal Vedic chart with current transits, and seems to suggest the YES, Harry is getting married.  I might add that 5th and 11th Houses suggest children.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2017, 06:02:05 PM by Halina »

Offline Pamela Young

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Sorry for the delay in getting back to this thread; I've been tied up with some family stuff.  (All I can say is, don't ever have anything to do with wills or inheritance if you can possibly avoid it; what a nightmare).

Thank you so much, pdw, Dean and Halina, for your comments.  You've all mentioned that it looks like Harry and Meghan are, at the very least, in for a difficult time in their efforts to legitimize their relationship; at worst, it looks like the relationship may not survive the interference from the palace which looks likely to ensue.  The most recent things I've seen online say that Meghan is ready to give up her acting career to make a life with Harry, that she had been starting to think of giving up acting to devote herself to her charity work even before she met him.

 There are different rumours around, such as that Kate's sister, Pippa Middleton, does not want Meghan to attend her wedding, because she does not intend to be outshone at her own wedding by Meghan, as happened to the other bride a couple of weeks back. So supposedly, Pippa is saying "No ring, no bring", i.e., you can't bring someone with you to the wedding unless the two of you are married or at least officially engaged.  So now people are wondering if this will cause Harry to speed things up and present Meghan with an engagement ring before Pippa's wedding;  they're saying he wants to use jewels from his mother Diana's tiara for it.  I have no idea how much of this is true, if any.

Pdw, thanks especially for your thoughts on the optimism and confidence that Meghan is given by her fiery Sun-MC trine and her Sun-Jupiter sextile; this is very true, and I think it's part of what Harry finds attractive about her, but then, everyone seems to.  She has an attractive personality, despite what her sister and ex-boyfriend seem to think.  I suppose with the emphasis on Leo, Aries and the 1st house, a case could be made for her being narcissistic, but I don't think it holds water; I think you hit the nail on the head when you said, 'A natural poise, sincerity, and a serious sense of purpose might be reflected by her thoughtful Libra Moon-Saturn-Jupiter, a very socializing influence combined with her aforementioned humanitarian interests, activities, and self-expression...'  I don't think she's narcissistic or selfish, far from it.

Dean, I'm worried too about transiting Saturn quincunx Harry's Moon and approaching his Neptune in the 12th.  As much as I think these two people are pretty right for each other, I don't know if it will work out for them.  Did you read what I posted about their composite chart on the other thread?  Here's the link, in case you missed it. 
www.noeltyl.com/discussion/index.php?topic=8322.15

Halina, thanks very much for the charts.  I'm not sure I understood your last post, about the Vedic charts.  Are you saying it looks like he will marry Meghan or he won't?  Or just that it looks like he will get married, but not necessarily to her?
« Last Edit: March 22, 2017, 06:34:21 AM by Pamela Young »

Offline Halina

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Hi Pam,  Yes, the Vedic chart says wedding most significantly, to each other......the Middleton, Pippa.wedding may be the motivating spark for them to also tie the knot.

Offline amymaddalozzo

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I think, strangely enough, that marrying an actress is an advantage for Harry because she is used to being in the limelight.  She would have  to  change her faith, I think.  AMY

Offline Pamela Young

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Hi Pam,  Yes, the Vedic chart says wedding most significantly, to each other......the Middleton, Pippa.wedding may be the motivating spark for them to also tie the knot.

Thanks for the clarification, Halina.

Offline Pamela Young

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I think, strangely enough, that marrying an actress is an advantage for Harry because she is used to being in the limelight.  She would have  to  change her faith, I think.  AMY

Hi Amy,

I agree, the fact that she's used to being in the limelight and dealing with paparazzi, etc., will definitely make it easier for her to adjust to the intrusions on her privacy that being with a member of the royal family will incur.  As I recall, it's already been remarked on in the British press that she's handling all the attention much better, or shall we say more easily, than previous girlfriends of Harry's, e.g., Cressida Bonas and Chelsy Davy. 

You're right, she almost certainly would have to convert to Anglicanism, but I don't think that would be a problem for her.  I don't think she's religious at all in a traditional way, so that would just be a formality for her.

Offline Pamela Young

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Meghan Markle's older half-sister Samantha Grant has alleged that Meghan is narcissistic, selfish and a hypocrite; since she's been dating Harry, Samantha also calls her "Princess Pushy," which implies that she regards her as a social climber.  Meanwhile, Meghan's former partner, Cory Vitiello, with whom she lived for several years right before meeting Harry, is alleged to have said that she is full of herself (i.e., conceited and arrogant).  Can the astrology tell us if any of this is true?

There is a thread on narcissism in the General Astrology section:  in www.noeltyl.com/discussion/index.php?topic=6999.0

In that thread, in Reply #5 it is said that people who are narcissistic exhibit a 'pervasive pattern of feeling "special," above others, entitled, etc.'  This syndrome is said to have developed in response to the individual experiencing 'extreme insecurity and profound emptiness.'  A more detailed list of the symptoms of Narcissistic Personality Disorder is given, as follows:

  'Grandiose sense of self-importance
   Preoccupation with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
   Belief that one is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people
   Requires excessive admiration
   Strong sense of entitlement
   Exploitative of others
   Lacks empathy
   Envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her
   Arrogant, taught behaviours or attitudes'   

The poster, ChrisSarah, goes on to say, 'I would expect to see outer planets ruling or configured with rulers of the angles and of Houses 2 and 11, especially; a dysfunctional Uranus or dysfunctional Leo/Aquarian signature as Don [Borkowski] points out; and maybe an Eastern hemisphere emphasis.  I've also seen these types of symptoms within Pisces-influenced individuals.'   

If it is true, as Meghan's boyfriend Cory Vitiello is said to believe, that she is conceited and arrogant, those characteristics would fall within the list of symptoms given for narcissism above.  And if it is indeed the case, as her half-sister has said, that she is selfish, with the implication that she is a social climber, that would be additional evidence indicating that Meghan could possibly suffer form Narcissistic Personality Disorder.  So, keeping in mind all the points given in the list above, does Meghan's chart tell us she is narcissistic?

First off, her Sun is in Leo, the sign of the 'star,' as are her Mercury and North Node; moreover, they are in the 1st house, the natural house of Aries.  Aries is a fire sign like Leo, and as befits the fact that it is on the cusp of the natural 1st house, it says, "I'm Number One; I'm top dog; everybody follow me."  Aries believes it is born to lead, and can be selfish (as for 'Princess Pushy,' I happen to have a pin in my possession from eons ago with a cartoon of a ram butting someone, which says, 'I'm Aries - I'm pushy.'  For what that's worth ...).  Meghan has Aries on the MC (her reputation and public stature) and it is tightly trined by her Leo Sun, as well as by her Mercury.  So she has the requisite Leo signature.  Her chart also has a strong Eastern emphasis, with only the three outer planets on the Western side of the chart.

As for outer planets ruling or configured with the rulers of the angles and of the 2nd and 11th houses, she has Uranus trining her Ascendant, and it opposes her 11th house Chiron.  Now, Mars is not an outer planet, but it rules her empty 10th house (parental figure, usually the mother) with Aries on the MC; moreover, it is squaring her MC very tightly, from the 12th house (hidden things; victims) and it's in Cancer (the mother; nurturing).  So I'd say it is possible that, when growing up, Meghan felt the absence of her mother as a void in her life, and that the mothering figure (purportedly her older half-sister Samantha) was violent towards her, if only in a non-physical way.  It's possible - but that doesn't necessarily mean that she experienced 'extreme insecurity and profound emptiness.'  She has many very positive things in her chart to counterbalance the Mars-MC square, such as the Libra stellium involving her chart ruler, the Moon.

Does she lack empathy?  That certainly would not appear to be the case. Does she exploit others? I'm not sure this is something that we plebs who don't personally know her are in a position to judge; but from what I've read, she doesn't seem to.  Harry pursued her; it wasn't the other way round.  As for envying others, it sounds to me like it's her sister Samantha who envies Meghan.

You can have a marked Leo emphasis in your chart without being a narcissist; I can think of a couple of people, offhand, who fit this bill, people I know well.  On the other hand, there can be people who seem to fit the narcissist label, as defined by the list of characteristics quoted above, whose charts don't seem to fit what one might expect at all.  So is Meghan Markle a narcissist?  For now, in the absence of more detailed information, I'm going to say: no.

       

                     
« Last Edit: Today at 02:10:10 PM by Pamela Young »