Author Topic: Santa Barbara University Shooting  (Read 15820 times)

Offline jon layton

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #30 on: May 26, 2014, 12:54:55 PM »

Hi guys, you are all making great points. Even though it's a tragic situation I think it's healthy for us astrologers to express ouselves through our astrology and try to make some sense of it at this time. I wanted to post my suggested horoscope for Elliot Rodger here as I neglected to do so above and also expand a little bit more on my line of thinking.

The more I think about it the more I'm convinced of a Cancer Ascendant. In my opinion there would need to be a feminine sign on the Ascendant, he was shy and super sensitive, he apparently couldn't directly approach women to ask them out. Everything was done in an indirect way such as spilling his starbucks on "happy" couples out of jealously.This is Cancer's mode of operation gone really wrong. The Cancer ASC would frustrate the Leonine needs and I think with a Leo ASC and Jupiter there as Barbara suggested he would of directly been able to express his needs better.

PDW in line with your thinking with a Cancer ASC the ruler Moon would go into the sixth house. Incidently this would be the same Sun-Moon-Ascedant blend as Arnold Schwarzenegger and apparently he had a similar obsession with perfecting his body and bodybuilding.

His dark creative self expression such as the youtube videos he made and the manifesto he wrote fits Pluto in Scorpio in the 5th house and of course this Pluto squares Jupiter suggesting the fanaticism of it all. And so on.....

Happy Memorial Day!

Jon

Offline In Stitches

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #31 on: May 26, 2014, 01:16:21 PM »
Jon your argument for cancer rising is pretty compelling, but I'll add my 2cents here and say that I agree with pdw's Virgo Rising.  I used to know someone with Virgo rising who had some of the characteristics that Rodger had. Reserved to point of making other people nervous, extreme materialism, jealous of everything I had and did and got even with me for that.  I seem to keep noticing Virgo in a lot of these mass shooters.  Sometimes I think that their parents Pluto in virgos must contact their Virgo planets in a way which they can't handle.

Also, his public display of his virginity.  Virgo is the virgin. 
« Last Edit: May 26, 2014, 01:21:08 PM by In Stitches »

Offline jon layton

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2014, 04:00:28 PM »

In Stitches and PDW you guys make a fine case for Virgo. I can see having a birthtime of about 9am (9-10 Virgo Rising) because that would be the same as the IC/MC axis in my suggested 13 Cancer Rising Horoscope. So we would get some of the same same angular "hits" for life events. Instead of having Pluto on the MC as it would be in Santa Barbara chart for 3:45am it would move to the Descendant in Santa Barbara chart for 9am. I think an angular Pluto in relocated horoscope is important!

I would argue we lose the transiting Pluto-Uranus square hitting an angle at the time of the tragedy. Although transiting Pluto would be closely sesqui- square Asc/MC ruling Mercury.
We already have a strong built in Virgo dimension to this horoscope with the Venus-Mars conjunction which would be angular and opposite the Midheaven in 3:45am Horoscope. The 6th house chart ruling Moon would also have some Virgo characteristics. Materialism could be seen through the second house Leo Sun and Capricorn Moon.

Sunrise is about 5am in London in July and he wrote "on the morning of July 24". What's his definition of morning? I would think both Cancer and Virgo would be considered morning. Since he included his birth weight "5.4 pounds" I think he's giving an honest account. He liked to talk about himself.

Anyways obviously I can see your argument for Virgo but I  still think it's Cancer. It's the indirectness and sentimentalism that point me in that direction.

Jon

Offline Barbara Ybarra

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2014, 09:16:20 PM »
No one has mentioned solar arcs (have they?).  It might be a clue to see if any solar arcs have been made to what might be the Ascendant for this killer.  Jupiter has arrived at 11 Virgo which (if the Asc) could have triggered the ultimate desire to be unique (trine to his Uranus).   I am thinking that a Virgo Asc seems to fit ok (in general) and keeps the stellium in the 5th.  But in that case the 5th is ruled by Saturn which seems to calm it down somewhat.  His solar arc Sun and Chiron arrived at 22 Leo….possible Asc?….the coming forward of a pain-filled life.

I do agree with Jon in that it is appropriate to labor over some understanding as astrologers.  Sometimes it strikes us as just one more horrible thing, but then one day these things becomes too many. 

If we have anything to go on, common sense leads us to trust a person's biography that he was born in the "morning".  If he was born at 3am-ish it is more of the story of being born "in the middle of the night". 

   

 

Offline jon layton

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2014, 10:36:30 PM »

Hi Barbara,

Yes the solar arc of the Jupiter(11 Virgo) square Pluto(9 Sagittarius) is in part what I based the 3:45 Cancer time on as the MC/IC axis would be at 10 Pisces/Virgo and later the 9am Virgo time.

I agree 3:45am seems middle of the night(ish) but it is technically early morning and late Cancer would be sunrise (0 Leo Sun). Anyways sorry Barbara didn't mean to dismiss the Leo Ascendant suggestion as it very well could be.

There's a very good chance that at some point his true birthtime will be revealed (as he was born in the 90's) and we'll be like oh yeah that makes perfect sense. Good exercise though and a reminder to keep an open mind.

Jon

Offline Antonio

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #35 on: May 27, 2014, 03:48:40 AM »
The tree was damaged and now is dead. The autopsy is done... but the diagnostic is still unclear. Time to look at the forest and take care of the living.

For such a huge task, from the top of my ignorance I call the mundane experts, vedic gurus, sweet exorcists [Curtis Mayfield comes to mind] and "new age" theorists. The last ones mentioned were the first to arrive. I hope they're right:

 "Children of the Fifth World: A Guide to the Coming Changes in Human Consciousness"
by P. M. H. Atwater L.H.D

"Our species is evolving in preparation for the new world on the horizon"

"Explains how the increase in intuitive, creative, and abstract-thinking abilities of children as well as incidences of ADHD, dyslexia, and autism signal evolutionary changes at work in humanity--the emergence of the Fifth Root Race" [...] "Sharing individual case histories underscoring the traits of the new-child personality, she reveals how these children, born with universal consciousness encoded in their DNA, act as agents for world change by reflecting back every misguided aspect of business, politics, religion, entertainment, technology, and culture so we can’t ignore what needs to be repaired."

"There's no need to worry, the times dictate a plan
Mother Earth's given birth to a brand new man
Sister I know you're misunderstood
But hold on to your man 'cause the future looks good
It's a new day

A new world order, a brand new day
A change of mind for the human race"

Curtis Mayfield - New World Order Lyrics
« Last Edit: May 27, 2014, 04:02:48 AM by Antonio »

Offline Barbara Ybarra

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #36 on: May 27, 2014, 06:44:06 AM »
Jon, no worries, its not important who is right and you did not dismiss me, and Cancer could be correct.  As a cardinal sign a Cancer will take action when a Leo will dig his heels into one place and stand his ground.  You are right about the hindsight, too.

Antonio, it does seem like there is some correlation of these incidents with the growing numbers of people in the world.   The loud and obnoxious ones disturb the ones who can be pushed to a breaking point. 

   

Offline Steven7

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #37 on: May 27, 2014, 07:24:22 AM »
 Francine thanks for Astrowin chart source.

Page 1 Halina's event chart shows Uranus op Mars  the axis points are 12 ds Capricorn and Cancer

Page 2 Francine's chart shows progressed lilith dark moon at 12 Capricorn  ( center wheel )
 The progressed MC also at 12 Capricorn may or may not be  correct because certain birth time is unknown but the progressed Lilith should be good.
 Mars and Uranus are pointing to Progressed Lilith at that time.

Just another clue for the mystery.

Offline Halina

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #38 on: May 27, 2014, 07:41:59 AM »
Hi Steven 7, in Numerology the number 12....The sacrifice.  Being sacrificed or becoming a victim to other persons' plans, ambitions or intrigues.  12 warns against being a victim of circumstances(Majority of planets above the horizon...Tyl), or dragged into other people's affairs where you will be the one suffering the consequences.  12 may also make a conscious sacrifice.  Also: creativity, writers(he wrote a long piece about women victimizing him).   Francine's last chart, Scorpio rising would put most of his planets above the horizon.
     Let's consider his name...e-l-l-I-O-t....astrologically.  The letter e is Mercury it must be angular, it  is at the top of Francines chart....double l is for the planet Venus, it must be angular, it is at the top....I is for Taurus, it must be angular, it is on the 7th cusp...O is for Scorpio, it must be angular, it is as the Asc....t is either Pisces or its ruler Neptune or Jupiter...Pisces on IC, Jupiter angular.   Now look at Francine's chart again and you will see all these factors meet the requirements.   Anyone's name will always affect the angular parts of one's horoscope.
    This chart puts a stellium in the 9th of University and philosophy....he attended University and majored in Philosophy.  He moved at age 7...SA Mercury conj MH at this time.   Materialism indicated by Moon stellium in 2nd.
    Only one thing wrong here with Francine's chart.....he said he was born in the morning but Francine's chart is afternoon.
Therefore my vote is for the Virgo rising chart.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2014, 09:37:44 AM by Halina »

Offline Francine

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #39 on: May 27, 2014, 09:20:16 AM »
I can certainly see a good point for a Virgo rising since this is all about his virginity at age 22. Then I thought I'd move the the ascendant around until I could get the midheaven opposite Pluto at the time he moved from Britain when he was 5. I came up with 24 Leo rising, leaving the stellium of planets in the 5th house. And since I am such a fan of the La Volasfera degrees I had a look for 24 Leo:
24-25 deg Leo    A reversed triangle upon a red ground.    It denotes a person of a very passionate and emotional nature, who will suffer through the allurements of the other sex, and at some time in his life will be liable to suffocation or drowning. The native will certainly be in danger through the watery element. The fortunes will be in danger of reversal, and that through the passionate nature of the native. The nature is incapable of any steady effort, and is, in short, as soft and unstable as water. It is a degree of INSTABILITY.

That seems fitting, the triangle on a red ground reminds me of all the blood he shed and the triangle being where the bodies lay.

Looking at the SA chart for the day of the killings, his midheaven is in a critical degree 4 Gemini within orb of squaring his Mars and SA Saturn is conjunct his descendant (the end?) I don't know, just conjecture but I've attached a chart for the year he moved and a chart for the day of the killings.

Offline Halina

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #40 on: May 27, 2014, 09:44:37 AM »
    His name resonates to the Virgo rising chart....let's spell it out... E is for Mercury angular at the Asc...L-L is double Venus, angular at the Asc....I is for Taurus angular at the MH....O is for Scorpio angular at the IC....T-T is for Pisces angular at the Descendant, and its ruler Jupiter angular at the Asc.   Any person's name must fit across the angular parts of their horoscope, I have checked this on thousands of charts.    Below is the Virgo rising chart.  His move to America is signified by SA Mercury conj Ascendant and nMars, ruler 9th, long trip, at age 7.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2014, 09:52:12 AM by Halina »

Offline Halina

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #41 on: May 27, 2014, 10:15:39 AM »
    For forumites who have worked hard at suggesting a possible Ascendant, your chart should show a Lunar Return chart for his death, at 9:30pm, Isla Vista, Cal and this chart should show Pluto, ruler 8th, death on an angle.   If you can show me this, I will believe your proposed Asc.   In the meantime, here is his Lunar Return for death using the Virgo Asc chart.   Please notice Lunar Return Pluto, r8th, death conjunct his Descendant, his departure.   We also have Lunar Return Vertex here.   No doubt about it, Virgo rising chart for me.
     The move from England is echoed 3 times in the Virgo rising chart:
1. SA Mercury conj n.Asc-Mars, r9, long trip.   2. SA Pluto conj natal IC, change of home   3. SA Moon conj nUranus, change of family residence.
Since a couple of these contact the ANGLES, there is no doubt he has Virgo rising.   His 25Taurus MH exactly conj the MOST EVIL FIXED STAR, ALGOL.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2014, 01:11:36 PM by Halina »

Offline Halina

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Another Infamous Woman Hater: Marc Lepine
« Reply #42 on: May 27, 2014, 01:23:13 PM »
    Rodger is not the first explicitly misogynist terrorist. In 1989, Marc Lepine shot 14 women at an engineering school in Montreal, Quebec. Eyewitnesses said that Lepine accused his victims of being feminists before he opened fire and reported that he selectively targeted women. Amazingly, Lepine’s actions were initially dismissed by officials as those of an apolitical madman and the police suppressed his suicide note on the pretext that it might inspire “copycat crimes,” but Lepine’s political agenda was proven when the note was leaked to the press. It read in part:
"Would you note that if I commit suicide today it is not for economic reasons … but for political reasons," it read. "Because I have decided to send the feminists, who have always ruined my life, to their Maker … I have decided to put an end to those viragos."
 
« Last Edit: May 27, 2014, 04:19:39 PM by Halina »

Offline Bioreader

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Re: Santa Barbara University Shooting
« Reply #43 on: May 28, 2014, 06:15:10 PM »
An egotistical lone wolf on a quest to become famous for something?  It's the lone wolves that will forever fly under the radar screens of the police departments in this country, never know when they're going to strike!  Comparable to earthquakes!

Capricorn Moon here, yup, always fantasizing about become famous for something.  Hitler, too, but his dreams were actually realized!

Offline In Stitches

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Re: Another Infamous Woman Hater: Marc Lepine
« Reply #44 on: May 28, 2014, 07:59:13 PM »
   Rodger is not the first explicitly misogynist terrorist. In 1989, Marc Lepine shot 14 women at an engineering school in Montreal, Quebec. Eyewitnesses said that Lepine accused his victims of being feminists before he opened fire and reported that he selectively targeted women. Amazingly, Lepine’s actions were initially dismissed by officials as those of an apolitical madman and the police suppressed his suicide note on the pretext that it might inspire “copycat crimes,” but Lepine’s political agenda was proven when the note was leaked to the press. It read in part:
"Would you note that if I commit suicide today it is not for economic reasons … but for political reasons," it read. "Because I have decided to send the feminists, who have always ruined my life, to their Maker … I have decided to put an end to those viragos."
 

Thanks for this example, Halina.  There are lots of misogynists who are serial killers and rapists. 

Right off the bat I can see some similarities.  Sun is trine Saturn instead of opposing.  Venus is also in Virgo and is prominent because squaring the nodes to the degree.  So shyness but with a need for control.  Moon is in cancer, opposite sign of Rodgers moon, but shows the same pole related to traditional values.  Not expressed well, of course, in both cases.

Interesting that, according to the wiki article about this guy, he was seven at the time of his parents divorce so probably had just finished his first secondary progressed lunar square putting stress on the expression of the natal moon through life.  As I said before I have found that these kids can tend to feel picked on.  Moon equals women.  Parents need to continue with family traditions like eating together at night for kids to make it through this age, especially for a cancer moon.